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Offline tdc911


  • Joined: Apr 2006

  • Location:
  • Drives:
Because it's consideration for your time at the track and investment in your camera kit (and time off work etc).  It'd be different if you were already being paid by the event organiser to take and distribute your pics.
The way I see it is this; for a motorsport event or trackday the driver and team has already paid a large amount for use of the track or participation in the event. If they do not attend you are not going to get photos of their car, simple as that. You own the rights to the photo of their car and basically can do what you want with that photo. The question is, would you give a cut of the proceeds from that photo to the driver of the car? If he/she had a spectacular accident and you got paid from a newspaper to publish the photo, would you split the cut?
If you believe you should be paid for your time at the track then you should arrange with the event organiser to pay for your time.



Offline 98octane

The way I see it is this; for a motorsport event or trackday the driver and team has already paid a large amount for use of the track or participation in the event. If they do not attend you are not going to get photos of their car, simple as that. You own the rights to the photo of their car and basically can do what you want with that photo. The question is, would you give a cut of the proceeds from that photo to the driver of the car? If he/she had a spectacular accident and you got paid from a newspaper to publish the photo, would you split the cut?
If you believe you should be paid for your time at the track then you should arrange with the event organiser to pay for your time.

Yes, I see your point.  But everyone leapfrogs off someone else's work to create their own products, and this is no different.  You are "value adding" to the event and the drivers' experience/memory of the event by providing photos of it.  If you take architectural photos, you don't pay the building's owner/architect; or landscape photos, the farmer or winery owner.  Should an artist/musician pay those artists/musicians whose work inspired their work?  No, because you're adding something to what they've done anyway - your time, talent and investment.  I expect that most other businesses also use other people's concepts and work in some way and progress it or add something to it to form their own product.

PS.  I'm not talking about stealing someone else's ideas, or misusing their IP, etc - that's a whole new ballgame.



Offline mhh

  • Chief Test Pilot

  • Joined: Feb 2006

  • Location: Adelaide
I paid for a poster of a pic Doctor took in CA because he added some value. I wouldn't pay for an image the likeness of which could be found easily on the Internet, because it is of no value. I doubt an owner would want to pay for images of their own static car though - why would they when they look at the real thing each day?

I'd love to see some of the guys who shoot on here make money from their hobby but I suspect that a photographers' forum might be a better place to ask.



Offline OzCarSightings

  • Will eat your baby
  • Photographer

  • Joined: May 2006

  • Drives: GenF HSV/Golf R32/motorbike
  • Location: Perth
  • www: JanGlovac.com
I doubt an owner would want to pay for images of their own static car though - why would they when they look at the real thing each day?


You'd be surprised!

The majority of owners of cars on my site that I have shot (http://ozcarsightings.com/photoshoots.php) paid for the service. I don't often ask exactly why they want the photos but why not, especially once you sell the car it might be nice to have some memories of it. I've done a fair few shoots for guys in local car clubs (I don't put those pics on my site, prefer to keep it for exotics/luxury cars) also, they are definately more willing to have photos taken and pay for them. Different mentality I suppose.

In the end I do it because I love cars and the challenge of trying to take a nice photograph, making the extra money that I do on the side is a bonus.

So I assume you keep all IP in all images you take and just give clients a limited licence to use the images.  In the case of clients who paid for a shoot, they can use the pics for anything.  One-off users get a limited licence to use the pic.  Has anyone ever breached your terms?

Pretty much. Nobody has breached terms yet....that I know of! :)



Offline Brenton

  • 300kph+ club
  • DJ's like a mad ...........

  • Joined: May 2009

  • Drives: Yes
  • Location: Adelaide
If you go out to a track day to take a couple of pics on your own invite or on the understanding that you are invited out there but we are not paying for your time (there on your own back) then no the shots that you take of the guys should be passed on for free.
The drive gives you the shot
The photographer gives him back the shot

If you are asked to shot his car (for various reasons) it is no different than enlisting a studio photographer to photograph a car for toyota. You may just do it at a lower rate as it is alot more casual. A hundred bucks or so.





Offline dkabab

you wouldnt ask a plumber to fix a tap for you, or a painter to paint you're portrait for you and expect it done for free.... why should photography be any different. i have all the tools to be a carpenter, but i could never build a house. just because people have cameras, doesnt mean they are photographers. its a skill and a talent, dont sell yourself short.

IMO as per the original question, for a photoshoot for someone whos requested your services, i would ballpark say $300. now if you're going to be doing "rig shots" which require a few hours to setup, then i would double at least.

if the photos are going to be used for commercial use... ie an advert or poster, then i would discuss licencing and get a contract drawn up on what they can and cant use the photos for.



Offline allanuber


  • Joined: Aug 2007

  • Location: Sydney
  • Name: Al

What do you guys do about a 'release' to use each photo?

I'm battling with this on a big project now - and I've been led to understand that if you for instance take a photo of a car/driver, then you cannot benefit from that commercially without a release or understanding from the subject?
C'mon, do it!



Offline dkabab

luckily ive never sold a photo of someone/car to someone who didnt own or drive the car... so ive not had to battle this issue.

technically when we sign on as media photographers for racing events, the photos we take are for editorial use only. that said, i and every other photographer have sold many photos to entrants etc... the media controllers for the events generally dont care unless you're actively obstructing the authorised photographer who sells to the entrants/publc via the event.




Offline allanuber


  • Joined: Aug 2007

  • Location: Sydney
  • Name: Al
luckily ive never sold a photo of someone/car to someone who didnt own or drive the car... so ive not had to battle this issue.

technically when we sign on as media photographers for racing events, the photos we take are for editorial use only. that said, i and every other photographer have sold many photos to entrants etc... the media controllers for the events generally dont care unless you're actively obstructing the authorised photographer who sells to the entrants/publc via the event.



I think the issue is more about the subject - if they do indeed see a picture you have taken of them/their car and they for whatever reason say you don't have permission to have resold it?
C'mon, do it!



Offline dkabab

do magazines get sued for paparazzi style photos of every celeb that gets published... i think they can get sued for defamation if its that sort of photo...

i dont know the black/white law about it, but i do know i can go take a photo of a crowd of people in a public place and no one can stop me... what i can do with that photo im not 100% sure... but its a grey area



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