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Offline 360c

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And if you buy your tyres or oil from Ferrari, is it more original than buying from the manufacturer or other distributor of the exact same item?

Bottom line.... If it looks original, and tests to be original, and an official from the manufacturer or other respected/appointed authority declares it original... Its original.

Underlined in bold...... Neither tdc911 nor anyone here can truly decide or declare.

Some of us can speak from opinion, some from fact, some from profession. And some, all of the above.

Oils are stretching it as you have to analyze them to tell the difference. Tyres, well that's a different story. If the manufacturer stops making them (F50, Miura for example) you are stuffed from a concour point of view. People go so far as to fit old stock period tyres which you can't even drive on. Nuts; but that's what happens in the big show events.

As for declaring the rules, I'm merely looking at it from the current rules and conventions that apply in the big events. Remember those rules are subject to change as well. I am sure many would remember the Pebble Beach restorations of the 1970's where the cars were ridiculously over restored and over done. The standards for that event today are vastly different from those that applied back then.



Offline mondi

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I know of several examples where various people have tried...........and failed.  The Formula 1 paint that my Michelotto is painted with is an example. Only available to the Ferrari racing team and very well connected private individuals with close ties to the race team. Several local guys tried to colour match it without success, close but different enough to pick pretty easily.  I ended up buying it through Maranello Motorsport who ran one of Schumachers old F1 cars at the time. Cost an insane amount of money too; but that was to be expected.

Even if you have the paint, you can have trouble matching existing paintwork. Especially pearls and matts and weird shades like Rosso Mugello that flip heaps even though they are not metallic. That comes down to painting technique and Ferrari themselves don't get that right. My Scud had 3M film from new (I have pre-delivery invoice) and when I got it the car had differences between panels and it had never been repaired.


If they can't get it right then no one else has a hope......


It sounds to me like they design these paints so you just leave the freaking car in the garage so it don't get scratched!!!!!

Or take it up the bum and go to a dealer????


We have had some cracking success with a paint colour analyser dude before, but it's not cheap......



Offline 360c

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If they can't get it right then no one else has a hope......


It sounds to me like they design these paints so you just leave the freaking car in the garage so it don't get scratched!!!!!

Or take it up the bum and go to a dealer????


We have had some cracking success with a paint colour analyser dude before, but it's not cheap......

"Or take it up the bum and go to a dealer????"

Bang on the money. All of Ferraris policies are designed to make you go through the dealer network for everything. It's been that way for decades, they are just really good at it now.

Try buying a Ferrari specific part from the original manufacturer. They will tell you forget it, we can only supply Ferrari or we will lose our contract. That started decades ago now.

Then came the computer diagnostics. You can't use a run of the mill industry SD computer because the codes are specific to Ferrari. Ferrari only sold them to their dealers, cutting out the independants who in theory had to refer back to the dealer network. That started with the 355, got harder with the 360 and even tougher with the 430. I think the current 458 system is different in that the dealer plugs the car into the 'puter and then it talks to the factory over the net, which then sends back the results. Might be corrected on that; but I think it's the case.

Similar thing happened with manuals. For years you could buy hard copy manuals, then they went to CD's which required a code to unlock them. That code was only supplied to the dealers, so even if you had the CD you needed the code or a cracked version of the CD. Now they don't even have CD's as it's all on the net from Ferrari itself. You can find sites with some part manuals on the net though.

I could go on; but you get the idea.



Offline TWD


  • Joined: Jan 2012

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"Police said thieves found the keys to the rare car when they broke inside the house, then managed to drive it from the secure garage without waking the occupants."

GT3 Race cars could wake the dead... :S



Offline Ferrari Fissatore

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The fluro paint came from an individual, not mm (they werent even formed then).

But its available quite easily and even MUCH more cheaply now.

And diagnostics are pretty well sorted aftermarket now too.

The dealers grip on things is nowhere near as strong as they would like, and the massive majority of the grip they have is due to enormous amounts of misinformation.



Offline RMV

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Is a McLaren F1 that has been completely altered by the factory from original specification still 'original'?

For eg, s/n 072 which left the factory as a standard road car in black, went back to McLaren to have the HDK fitted, was later sold to an American who has had it repainted white with red exterior striping and decals and bright red interior.  All work done by McLaren.  Is it still an original car? 




Offline Ferrari Fissatore

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Is a McLaren F1 that has been completely altered by the factory from original specification still 'original'?

For eg, s/n 072 which left the factory as a standard road car in black, went back to McLaren to have the HDK fitted, was later sold to an American who has had it repainted white with red exterior striping and decals and bright red interior.  All work done by McLaren.  Is it still an original car?

I dont think so, but its still a factory car and valued accordingly.



Offline TomE


  • Joined: Aug 2010

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Sounds like everyone has a different opinion.

For my money an Original car has Original paint, Original running gear and Original interior all maintained as well as possible allowing for some normal wear and tear.

When I hear "Original" I think of a car that can be used to accurately document how the factory put the car together. Once someone starts "restoring" a car it can never be original again.

Just adding my 2c to Phils $50
 :p

"There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam... "



Offline 360c

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The fluro paint came from an individual, not mm (they werent even formed then).

But its available quite easily and even MUCH more cheaply now.

And diagnostics are pretty well sorted aftermarket now too.

The dealers grip on things is nowhere near as strong as they would like, and the massive majority of the grip they have is due to enormous amounts of misinformation.

I knew T-Rex would apply some "Tommie Tax" and that was what I was implying.

I have enough for another full repaint; but nice to know you can get it now anyway.

Diagnostics sorted? Unless things have changed you could do up to and including 360's; but after that it was borrowing the SD jigger. What's the deal with 458's then?

The dealers wouldn't be happy unless they had all of the business. Fair enough, competitive world and I suspect Ferrari doesn't leave a lot on the table for them to pay for those marble monuments they are expected to build.

You're welcome to clear up any misinformation or mistakes- as always  :p




Offline isj001

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"Police said thieves found the keys to the rare car when they broke inside the house, then managed to drive it from the secure garage without waking the occupants."

GT3 Race cars could wake the dead... :S

Have you been to Bellevue Hill? Living in Vaucluse I can tell you that garages can be 100m or more away from the house, they could be 8 floors or more from the living quarters. Not to mention the triple-glazing, soundproofing, sprawling gardens etc etc.

Most likely a service/tradesman connection. These guys scope the place while they are contracted, get keys/alarm codes to the place.

I would suggest extremely organised... have a truck down the road they drive the car into - probably deactivating locational gadgetry on the car in transit. Broken down and shipped in parts to Europe/Middle East the following day. You'd only need three or four guys and a truck. And you'd only be visible for a minute or two until the truck is back on typical roads and essentially invisible.

Maybe I am overthinking it, but that's how I'd do it



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