[shack]

It should be. It should be building and surplying rechargable motor kits for tradesmen and farmers and anyone else that could use something that ran all day and you recharged during the night.

They could be selling battery kits with inverters that could work as generator, save people running petrol powered generators for hours at a time. They could sell kits for homes for power outages, . If you keep it charged and the power goes out, plug it into a powerpoint and keep the fridge and other essentials running for hours. There was a guy on home life support in SA that died because his power went out, something like that could of saved him.

+1 The above is the key!!! - They are an energy company using distributed tech to provide energy globally!!

[anotherforumuser]

This article from 2013 puts the battery price at about $12k USD for a small car. Using a 50kWh battery with a price of $238/kWh
http://insideevs.com/tesla-battery-in-the-model-s-costs-less-than-a-quarter-of-the-car-in-most-cases/

This article from 2014. Navigant estimates the cost of materials going into a battery at the Tesla Gigafactory on a processed chemical basis (not the raw ore) is $69/kWh [this metric is per kW per hour of operation]. Tesla currently pays Panasonic $180/kW for their batteries.
http://reneweconomy.com.au/2014/battery-storage-costs-plunge-below100kwh-19365

So the idea of building with a Korean company is great.. unless you have some ego problems that makes that impossible. 

[allanuber]

+1 The above is the key!!! - They are an energy company using distributed tech to provide energy globally!!

Mate, can't hold a salesman down! So are they a tech company, or an energy company?

I've read this whole thread with great interest as it's amazing to see Tesla's magnificent entry into the market, but unsurprising to see the less glamourous world of quality control, maintenance, support, great communication and customer care is a challenge to a high-tech company.

We see it again and again with startups, the best ideas in the world don't keep up momentum if you lose sight of the customers who gave you the opportunity to fly.

Many startups don't even rally consider the customer - they are just a line on a projection, used to get investors excited and funding through the door - when it actually then comes to dealing with them, there are cries of anguish as joe public doesn't blow smoke up the founders ass when the product doesn't meet the hype (not saying this is Tesla, yet).

[Fil-Ski]

Mate, can't hold a salesman down! So are they a tech company, or an energy company?

I've read this whole thread with great interest as it's amazing to see Tesla's magnificent entry into the market, but unsurprising to see the less glamourous world of quality control, maintenance, support, great communication and customer care is a challenge to a high-tech company.

How about a car company?

[allanuber]

How about a car company?

I see where you're going mate, and I might share the same opinion 

[360c]

It should be. It should be building and surplying rechargable motor kits for tradesmen and farmers and anyone else that could use something that ran all day and you recharged during the night.

They could be selling battery kits with inverters that could work as generator, save people running petrol powered generators for hours at a time. They could sell kits for homes for power outages, . If you keep it charged and the power goes out, plug it into a powerpoint and keep the fridge and other essentials running for hours. There was a guy on home life support in SA that died because his power went out, something like that could of saved him.

That last paragraph describes roles that the Tesla powerwall fullfills or could fullfill if you wanted.
The thing to remember is that the Tesla home battery system is NOT  a new idea. My system uses a bank of gel pack batteries with a 24kw capacity. Cost was circa $24k for batteries. Telsa will sell you a very pretty lithium setup of much, much smaller capacity for half the price that can only power a small house for a few hours during peak periods. In a power failure simulation we ran my house for I think 3 days on solar & battery alone. It was mild weather so no A/C running and Tesla car wasn't charged. It is a pretty big double story house. Now the Tesla system is modular so you can go to 24Kw and beyond (as I can) but the cost is way more than good old tech batteries. Tesla lithium battery has one main advantage IMO and that is size. Each gel pack battery in my system weighs 70kg and they are huge. There is 24 of them so that is a fair space and a LOT of weight. If space is an issue go lithium, otherwise I can't see the point given the economics.

Tesla is fantastic at marketing and maintaining the hype. Look deeper and the reality can be different.

[360c]

This article from 2013 puts the battery price at about $12k USD for a small car. Using a 50kWh battery with a price of $238/kWh
http://insideevs.com/tesla-battery-in-the-model-s-costs-less-than-a-quarter-of-the-car-in-most-cases/

This article from 2014. Navigant estimates the cost of materials going into a battery at the Tesla Gigafactory on a processed chemical basis (not the raw ore) is $69/kWh [this metric is per kW per hour of operation]. Tesla currently pays Panasonic $180/kW for their batteries.
http://reneweconomy.com.au/2014/battery-storage-costs-plunge-below100kwh-19365

So the idea of building with a Korean company is great.. unless you have some ego problems that makes that impossible. 

Haven't read the articles as I am off to bed; but I will.
All I can say is that if it is based on information supplied by Tesla take it with a grain of salt in my personal experience.
My battery price of $45k US was from  US user posts on a Tesla forum. Nobody here knows or is willing to say how much they cost to buy from spare parts.

[allanuber]

360C - you're spot on with that analysis. The functionality and utility of the power wall is not in question - nor is the general idea of using batteries for power backup/redundancy. It's the cost that's still brutal.

There's the argument that higher volumes of use will bring down price, which is reasonable - but it'll also mean a lot more competition for Tesla who don't seem to really have anything particularly unique in the core technology, just better packaging and marketing.

[360c]

360C - you're spot on with that analysis. The functionality and utility of the power wall is not in question - nor is the general idea of using batteries for power backup/redundancy. It's the cost that's still brutal.

There's the argument that higher volumes of use will bring down price, which is reasonable - but it'll also mean a lot more competition for Tesla who don't seem to really have anything particularly unique in the core technology, just better packaging and marketing.

My guy says I can give you a Tesla wall if you want; but why would you if you know anything about the tech and what is available.

[anotherforumuser]

Tesla is fantastic at marketing and maintaining the hype. Look deeper and the reality can be different.

Thats the whole idea of what I was getting at... The economics of a huge increase in sales would bring the lithium battery prices down. It seems like Tesla has its head stuck in cars not in generating business with it's technology.  When this all started it was touted that Tesla had something special with its battery technology that they owned the rights to but now it doesnt seem that way at all.